Date: Tue, 7 Dec 99 19:54:08 EST From: Dwight McKay (The Moderator) Reply-To: Suns-at-Home@net-kitchen.com Subject: Suns-at-Home Digest V12 #35 To: Suns-at-Home-List Suns-at-Home Digest Tue, 7 Dec 99 Volume 12 : Issue 35 Today's Topics: "unix clones" Console Error Gateway woes NetBSD is *not* Linux! NVRAM Prestoserve drivers? HyperSPARC boot PROM? SS1 reporting ff:ff:ff: for an ethernet address... (2 msgs) sun monitors SunOS vs. *BSD for older Sun hardware... Suns-at-Home Digest V12 #34 +--------------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Submissions: suns-at-home@net-kitchen.com | | Requests: suns-at-home-request@net-kitchen.com | | WWW Archive access: http://www.net-kitchen.com/~sah | +--------------------------------------------------------------------------+ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 11:01:56 +0100 (MET) From: Francesco Messineo Subject: "unix clones" To: Suns-at-Home@net-kitchen.com >Objection! FreeBSD, NetBSD and OpenBSD are not "Unix clones". >They *are* Unix. For the uninitiated, sandwich any of those between Unix is a trade-mark, so neither of those is Unix. Quoting from the NetBSD home page: "The NetBSD Project is a collective volunteer effort to produce a freely available and redistributable UNIX-like operating system." They say Unix-like of course. Francesco Messineo IW8QPI - ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 20:14:59 -0800 From: "jc bernardo" Subject: Console Error To: suns-at-home@net-kitchen.com hi, i get this console error everytime i dial-up to the net. it only comes up when i'm having a session. as soon as i disconnect, it too disappears. in a thirty minute session, it appears over 15 times. i have no idea what it means or what to do about it. anyone have had the same experience please share a remedy. thanks in advance. # WARNING: processor level 12 onboard interrupt not serviced get your free gURLmAIL at http://www.gURLmAIL.com - ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 11:21:51 -0500 From: David Barber Subject: Gateway woes To: Suns-at-home Good Day, I'm running Solaris 7 on my Sparc2, (enduser install), and am trying to get my box to go out through my gateway. (win95/nat32) It's been working just fine all along, but I accidently mucked around with several files while I thought I was logged into my Solarix x86 box. (which was NOT talking to the gateway) I put the files back to what I believed they should be, but to no avail. The files in question are: /etc/defaultrouter - contains the IP of my nat32/gateway box /etc/resolv.conf - contains the IP of my nat32/gateway box, and my IP settings for my ISP's dns boxes. /etc/nsswitch.conf - I've added "dns" to the hosts: line, after the "file" entry. I can ping any box in my /etc/hosts file by name or IP address, and I can ping any outside internet IP address, no problem. When I try to ping an internet name, the box doesn't even try to go out. (nothing hits the ethernet segment, which I was monitoring with snoop) This is the same problem I was experiencing with my x86 box, which started this whole mess! (smart me....I've gone from 1 working and 1 not working, to 2 not working.....what progress!) I finally figured I'd changed something earlier that I really didn't mean to, so I broke down and reinstalled from scratch. After doing a complete reinstall, I'm in the same bucket now as I was an hour ago. (still not exiting the box for external traffic) Am I missing something obvious here? David PS - I've tried re-doing the default route with "route -f add net default 10.0.0.100 1", but again, no go. My netstat -rn works just fine, but my netstat -r hangs for about 1 minute trying do resolv IP addresses to names. Just another tidbit of info for this mystery! D. "As a man gets older, the distance he walked to school gets longer, the snow that fell gets deeper, the fish that got away gets bigger, and the taste of a steak gets sweeter" - ------------------------------ Date: 26 Nov 1999 09:29:13 -0600 From: peter@taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Subject: NetBSD is *not* Linux! To: Suns-at-Home@net-kitchen.com >Maybe it's a matter of taste, but i'd advise people to run SunOS. >It is still more mature and performs much better on old Sun hardware >than NetBSD or Linux. Given that SunOS on old Sun hardware effectively stopped development some years ago, and that NetBSD is based on a later version of the same source tree as SunOS, I think you're missing something if you really think SunOS is somehow more mature than NetBSD. Linux, yes, but why would you want to run an abandoned 4.2BSD derivative when you have 4.4-Lite available? I would even argue that NetBSD is closer to what SunOS would have been if Sun hadn't been seduced by the Dark Side (System V) than either SunOS-4 or Solaris. And if you want more of an adventure, try OpenBSD. Theo's gone through the kernel line-by-line fixing potential security holes before they show up, and it's a very small and tight system with nothing outside stock UNIX other than security software like OpenSSH. -- This is The Reverend Peter da Silva's Boring Sig File - there are no references to Wolves, Kibo, Discordianism, or The Church of the Subgenius in this document Executive Vice President, Corporate Communications, Entropy Gradient Reversals. - ------------------------------ Date: 26 Nov 1999 09:46:59 -0600 From: peter@taronga.com (Peter da Silva) Subject: NVRAM To: Suns-at-Home@net-kitchen.com >> Unfortunately, unless you wrote the Ethernet address and HostID down like >> me, you pretty much have to get a new NVRAM chip. >You assume that a NEW nvram chip holds an Ethernet address, but I don't think >so. In the FAQ, it says that even a new nvram chip needs to be programmed (ie: >has no ethernet address of its own). Of course, I am not sure of this. You can pretty much pick any 6 byte value for the MAC address and hostID, though you should probably make sure the first three bytes of the MAC are 08:00:20 so it looks like a Sun to network management tools. I used "C0:FF:EE" and "60:BA:BE". If you get a collision with these numbers you can blame me, but if you're on MY local LAN I wanna know how. -- This is The Reverend Peter da Silva's Boring Sig File - there are no references to Wolves, Kibo, Discordianism, or The Church of the Subgenius in this document Executive Vice President, Corporate Communications, Entropy Gradient Reversals. - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 19:21:37 -0000 From: "Gavin Saxby" Subject: Prestoserve drivers? HyperSPARC boot PROM? To: All, I have just got a Prestoserve NFS accelerator, but no driver software for it. Can anyone out there assist me? I also need to get a new BootPROM so I can use a single Ross HyperSPARC 166 in a Sparc20, does anyone have any ideas? Will I get a worthwhile speed increase from the current setup of dual SM71s? Current config is: Dual SM71s, 1.2Gb Boot disk, 4.2Gb extra disk, 352 Mb RAM, Leo (ZX) Graphics. Intended use is a personal machine (Netscape, Star Office, Quake) Regards, Gavin. Gavin Saxby. gav@porcupinetree.demon.co.uk - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 19:57:41 -0800 From: Perry The Cynic Subject: SS1 reporting ff:ff:ff: for an ethernet address... To: Gert.Cuypers@esat.kuleuven.ac.be I've lost the battery on a SS2 once, with exactly that result. If you don't mind a quick fix, you can solve the ethernet address problem easily. Nobody really cares about the host id (except for software that uses it for copy protection). The root user can use the ifconfig command to reprogram the ethernet address of an interface. I don't run SunOS/Solaris anymore, but look at the manpage for ifconfig; it's there. What address you pick is really quite unimportant, except that it not be the same as any other ethernet device on the same network segment. These numbers are assigned to be unique in the world. So just go to any computer who you know will never be on your network, pick its ethernet address, and use it. (Or just use 1:1:1:1:1:1 - the odds of that showing up in a contemporary ethernet adapter are astronomically small.) You will have to insert a suitable ifconfig command into the net startup scripts *before* the first IP-level ifconfig is executed. Cheers -- perry --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Perry The Cynic perry@cynic.org To a blind optimist, an optimistic realist must seem like an Accursed Cynic. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 16:44:10 +0100 From: Anders Andersson Subject: SS1 reporting ff:ff:ff: for an ethernet address... To: Suns-at-Home@net-kitchen.com "v bender" wrote: > Unfortunately, unless you wrote the Ethernet address and HostID down like > me, you pretty much have to get a new NVRAM chip. What are you going to > reprogram your Ethernet address to otherwise? Maybe you could get it off > the serial number of your machine somewhere in some database on Sun's > site... I was able to find the old Ethernet address in the system log file when I had replaced the chip. If you haven't been running without battery for too long (and thus maybe purged the old log files) you could find it just by grep'ing your logs for the text "Ethernet". Regards, Anders -- Anders Andersson Office phone: +46 8 58768500 SDRC Svenska AB Office fax: +46 8 58768599 Kronborgsgränd 7 Mobile phone: +46 709 151526 164 46 Kista, Sweden E-mail: anders.andersson@sdrc.com - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 20:13:35 EST From: LafsUnlmtd@aol.com Subject: sun monitors To: aek@wiretap.spies.com, jwbirdsa@picarefy.com, Bob.Mitton@eng.sun.com, i have about 4 sun 1662b monitors. i need to get rid of them, do you know anyone that wants these monitors? if so please send me an e-mail offer. i would appreciate it. eric b johnson - ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Nov 1999 13:56:00 -0500 (EST) From: woods@most.weird.com (Greg A. Woods) Subject: SunOS vs. *BSD for older Sun hardware... To: Suns-at-Home@net-kitchen.com (Suns-at-Home Mailing List) [ On Thursday, November 25, 1999 at 20:22:44 (EST), Dwight McKay (The Moderator) wrote: ] > In: Suns-at-Home Digest V12 #34 > Subject: DNS w/IP forwarding > > Maybe it's a matter of taste, but i'd advise people to run SunOS. > It is still more mature and performs much better on old Sun hardware > than NetBSD or Linux. I will start with the disclaimer that though I'm a big fan of old and ancient hardware, I've never had any real affection for old software. I'd just as soon run NetBSD on my PDP-11s as any of the original DEC software or even the now very dated 2.11BSD that was intended to run on them. As a programmer and software "engineer" I'm always keen to fix, change, and try new software. I suppose if I were merely a user of computers I would be much less inclined to "fix what ain't broke!" I did run SunOS-4 on my Sun-3's for some time, but only because back then the SCSI driver in NetBSD didn't do DMA and certainly the SunOS-4 driver was much faster than the NetBSD one, and those machines were at the time my main production systems. However that's now long past history and indeed with the newer "UVM" virtual memory subsystem in NetBSD the performance is almost always at least equal, if not better, than that of SunOS. The only feature of SunOS-4 that still exceeds NetBSD's current capabilities is the "unified buffer cache" -- i.e. the proper integration of the filesystem buffer cache with virtual memory paging. Though the performance problems related to this feature are rather application-specific and not so common, there are some potentially serious issues with applications which might use memory-mapped file I/O (something software written for SunOS is indeed likely to do). This problem with NetBSD will go away soon though -- the fixes are already under test. > SunOS is still supported by many major software packages and with the > spread of autoconf, SunOS remains supported in newer projects too! > Try it: gcc, X11R6, sendmail-8, they all build out of the box. Ah, but that's why it's irrelevant -- the same packages support NetBSD or OpenBSD equally well, or better in many cases now. For example I haven't tested Smail, which I maintain, on SunOS-4 for a long time now. I've no idea whether I've accidentally broken anything it for SunOS with recent changes or not. I know very well that the same issue applies for many other software packages (with the proof appearing as SunOS-4 bug reports after ever major release). As for "major commercial software packages", well that's why I mentioned that I run SunOS Netscape happily on NetBSD/sparc -- the binary emulation support for SunOS (and Solaris) binaries is excellent. > I think that having all these goodies as rpm (or -bin.tgz or whatever) > is nice for the WIMPs and the GURUs, but you don't learn anything if > you unpack a rpm... or find the stuff preinstalled by the OS. I'm not sure what that has to do with anything. Indeed with NetBSD there's the opportunity to use the "pkg" collection (either in binary or source form), but it's certainly not a required, or only, way of installing software. > I do not think that SunOS is inherently insecure. Oh, but it is (at least SunOS-4 is terribly insecure)! It's of course relatively easy to turn off all the vulnerable networks services that make SunOS-4 vulnerable from remote network attacks, but from the inside it's riddled with holes -- almost as insecure as IRIX; even after all available official patches have been installed. > The TCP/IP-stack is > not very vulnerable and with the tcp-wrapper, libwrap and portmap from > Vietse most (if not all) holes are stuffed. Those tools give a lot more control over who has access, but they don't necessarily plug security holes in and of themselves. Indeed even Darren Reed's IP Filter is available for SunOS-4 and SunOS-5, but it's native in NetBSD and OpenBSD.... :-) > And remember: If you miss > something, get the sources and build it! Ah, but if you miss something you'll have to first re-install from scratch to remove the tracks of the cracker, and then you'll have to install a non-native version of the service that was used to break in. This is not the ideal state of affairs! :-) In fact by the time you've fixed all the bugs in SunOS-4 you've probably built and installed almost everything in the GNU or NetBSD user-land anyway, as well as having hacked at your kernel to add IP Filter and perhaps other fixes. > I never had big problems > compiling software on SunOS. MY SunOS is full of all these nifty > programs that didn't even exist eight years ago: sendmail-8, popper, > dig, ... whatever i want. Note that the first step these days to compiling things is a relatively large and often daunting task of installing GCC (or EGCS). Building and installing X11R6.3 on SunOS-4 is realtively easy compared to GCC!. It's either that or try back-porting to K&R C. Many popular packages are no longer K&R compatible, and indeed many require a C++ compiler. I did the back-porting for hundreds of freeware tools about five years ago and though it was possible it wasn't always fun or easy. So, hands down there are almost no reasons to continue to run SunOS-4 on any older Sun hardware -- NetBSD really is a *lot* better platform. SunOS-5 is a slightly different story, especially on newer and/or multi-processor machines (and of course even yet for some of the more esoteric hardware [X.25 anyone? ;-)]). I'm not a big fan of SunOS-5 though, and never was, so I do have a hard time recommending it. It's just Unix System V Release 4 done "Sun's Way". Sure it has a pretty cool and increasingly efficient kernel, but from the admin point of view it's a big mess. I do agree that SunOS-4 was once *the* premier Unix operating system, and indeed it had the best mix of features from the various "camps". However it hasn't been actively developed for many years now. Indeed inside Sun there are very few people who have the tools, never mind the knowledge, necessary to build it from scratch (at least according to my friends who work there!). -- Greg A. Woods +1 416 218-0098 VE3TCP Planix, Inc. ; Secrets of the Weird - ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 04 Dec 1999 22:40:39 +0000 From: Bob Hoekstra Subject: Suns-at-Home Digest V12 #34 To: Suns-at-Home@net-kitchen.com Rick Leir wrote: > > which frame buffer would be the best one to put in a sparc 1+? > > The cgsix sbus card would be most appropriate. 256 colours, and > accelerated if you use Sun's libraries. Historical interest only. > cheers -- Rick Surely most SS1 and 1+ boxes would have comes with cg3? I would think you could pick up used ones almost for free. Only 8 bit colour, but works well enough. I use one on an SS2, and have a spare in case it dies. adh@an.bradford.ma.us (Sandwich Maker) wrote: > "An IPX makes a fine X terminal, fileserver and general Solaris portability > "tester for me. Add a Weitek 80MHz CPU and you've got something that starts > "to rival low-end 10s, 20s and SS4/5s. (No, I haven't yet got a Weitek; if > "anyone in the UK has them at a sensible price...) > > about 4-5 years ago, i was in an environment with a lot of sparc 1s, > 2s, 5s, 10s, and 20s; most of the 2s were weitekked. i was put in > charge of what to upgrade and how, and what to replace. i scrutinized > all the relevant benchmarks. > > as i recall, a ss5/70 was ~1.5x a ss2/weitek, ~3x a plain ss2; maybe a > 10/20 wasn't faster but anything later was. Around the same time I was in a similar position. We tested Weitekked and vanilla SS2s against other machines using our in-house software, which was largely (not entirely) processor bound in execution. We found the Weitek would speed an SS2 up by more than 80%, bringing it pretty close to an SS10 Model 30 in execution speed. However, this was (is) the slowest SS10 - a single 33MHz (I think) SuperSPARC. If you have to shunt a lot of data around (we were doing complex calcs with a smallish amount of data), the faster bus on the SS10 makes it superior, and multiprocessing (up to 4) and higher clocks speeds are possible. The SS4 & SS5 are faster as a single processor box, but could not beat the SS10 with multiple processors. The SS20 is still faster - Ross made (make?) HyperSPARCs up to The more recent OSses need a lot of power (shades of Mickeysoft). I've found that running Solaris 7 on my own Weitekked SS2 shows its limitations. I've been lucky enough to get a good deal on a 333MHz Ultra 5, which is really in quite a different class. My SS2 will stay on the network though, probably running SPARCLinux. -- -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- Version: 3.1 GO/! d- s++:+ a+ C++(++++) US+++$ P+ L+ E--- W++ N++ w--- O- V- PS+ PE- Y+ PGP- t+ 5++ X+ R* tv+ b+ DI++ D G e(*) h++/-- r+++ y? ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------ ----------------------------------------------------- Bob Hoekstra: APL & Unix Consultant Tele: +44 (0)1483 771028 (Home) +44 (0)7710 562345 (Mobile) Web site: http://www.khamsin.demon.co.uk Home email: Bob.Hoekstra@khamsin.demon.co.uk ----------------------------------------------------- - ------------------------------ End of Suns-at-Home Digest ******************************